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Lessons Learned About USA / China Enterprises Cooperation on Lithium E Bikes

Lessons Learned About USA / China Enterprises Cooperation on Lithium E Bikes. Ed Benjamin, Xiao Bin Ultra Motor UK, Suzhou Phylion. 中美企业在锂电池电动自行车合作中获取的经验教训. 艾德 . 本杰明 , 肖斌 英国宇劲 , 苏州星恒. Problems and Solutions in Export of Chinese Lithium Batteries for Ebikes.

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Lessons Learned About USA / China Enterprises Cooperation on Lithium E Bikes

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  1. Lessons Learned About USA / China Enterprises Cooperation on Lithium E Bikes Ed Benjamin, Xiao Bin Ultra Motor UK, Suzhou Phylion

  2. 中美企业在锂电池电动自行车合作中获取的经验教训中美企业在锂电池电动自行车合作中获取的经验教训 艾德.本杰明, 肖斌 英国宇劲, 苏州星恒

  3. Problems and Solutions in Export of Chinese Lithium Batteries for Ebikes • AECF (Now Ultra Motor USA), Suzhou Phylion, and Wettsen Ebikes cooperated to produce a high power, lithium ebike for USA Market. • Many problems occurred. Much money was lost. • Many lessons were learned!

  4. 中国的电动自行车用锂电池在出口方面的问题和解决方案中国的电动自行车用锂电池在出口方面的问题和解决方案 • AECF (现为宇劲美国),苏州星恒和玮辰电动车合作为美国市场生产大功率的锂电池电动自行车。 • 出现了很多问题。损失了很多钱。 • 得到了很多宝贵的经验教训!

  5. Phylion’s Vision: Provide the Best Media Between Grid and E-Appliances The best media between grid and E-appliances

  6. 星恒的展望:提供电网和电器设备的最佳媒介 The best media between grid and E-appliances

  7. PHYLION: Builds a complete Value Chain Powder Fundamental Research Cell Engineering Mass Production CustomizedSolutions

  8. 星恒:打造完整的价值链 粉末 基础研究 电池 工程 规模生产 定制方案

  9. AECF / UM Intro • Strong technical resources – unusual for distributor • USA Distribution • USA distributor , sold to Ultra Motor • Experienced team – Ed, Mike • Experienced assembler – Wettsen / Percy • Ultra Motor Strong in Indian Distribution, Technical and Design Team.

  10. AECF /宇劲简介 • 技术资源强大– 一般经销商不具有的优势 • 美国销售 • 美国经销商, 被宇劲收购 • 经验丰富的团队– 艾德.本杰明, 麦克.弗瑞斯 • 经验丰富的整车厂–玮辰/简敬修 • 宇劲在印度拥有优秀的销售，技术和设计团队

  11. Wettsen Introduction • Taiwanese invested, Longkou location, experienced builder of ebikes in Taiwan and China. • Lee Iacoccoa experience. • Percy Chien, Mike Fritz, Ed Benjamin all friends.

  12. 玮辰简介 • 由台湾投资，坐落于龙口，是台湾及大陆地区经验丰富的电动自行车制造商。 • Lee Iacoccoa 经验。 • 简敬修,麦克.弗瑞斯, 艾德.本杰明是朋友。

  13. Existing Wettsen Lead Acid Model Converted to Lithium Battery

  14. 现有的玮辰铅酸电池模型转为锂电池

  15. Technical Outline of Product • Users are USA people, taller, heavier, than Chinese. • Power on Demand, not pedelec. • Often used in hills in California. • Users not knowledgeable about ebikes. • Heinzmann brand German made motor. 24V, able to demand high amperage • Chinese controller from Wettsen • Battery from Phylion – 36 V 10 AH Li-Manganese, with BMS, packaging and charger.

  16. 产品技术概要 • 消费者是美国人，与中国人相比更高，更重。 • 随选动力式，而非助踩式。 • 经常在加州的山区使用。 • 消费者并不了解电动自行车。 • 德国产Heinzmann 牌24伏电机，可承受高电流量。 • 中国产玮辰控制器 • 星恒电池– 36 伏 10 安时锂锰电池, 带有电池管理系统, 包装和充电器。

  17. Product Development 2005…. We know a lot. We are strong. We will create a new world. We are the best. We are good partners.

  18. 产品开发 2005…. 我们知道很多。我们很优秀。我们可以创造一个新世界。我们是最棒的。我们是很好的合作伙伴。

  19. Late 2006 …Problems! Product no good！Supplier No good! 0 voltage battery BMS heating BMS shutdown

  20. 2006年年末…问题! 产品差！供应商差! 电池出现零电压 BMS 发热 BMS 停止工作

  21. AECF (UM) Blames Wettsen and Phylion They should solve the problem, it is their problem! 0 voltage battery BMS heating BMS shutdown

  22. AECF (宇劲) 指责玮辰和星恒 他们应该解决这个问题,这是他们的问题! 电池出现零电压 BMS 发热 BMS 停止工作

  23. Wettsen Blames Phylion, Phylion Blames Wettsen and AECF! They should re-design the product to reduce the cost. 0 voltage battery BMS heating BMS shutdown

  24. 玮辰指责星恒, 星恒指责玮辰和AECF! 他们应该重新设计产品来降低成本。 电池出现零电压 BMS 发热 BMS 停止工作

  25. Conflict Between Partners Stalls Solving the Problem! 0 voltage battery We do need to solve the problem. We should work together. BMS heating BMS shutdown

  26. 三方的争端拖延了问题的解决！ 电池出现零电压 我们需要解决问题。我们应该共同努力。 BMS 发热 BMS 停止工作

  27. Why low voltage battery? • Because the battery is over-discharged. • Why battery is over-discharged? • Because the data recorder continues to consume the power. • Power consumption by data recorder should have been part of original specifications. Why a problem? • The work current of the data record is twice higher than its spec. This was not known before. • Low voltage battery It is only 2 mA more. But it is twice the spec, and causes big problem and loss of money.

  28. 为什么电池会出现低电压? • 因为电池被过度放电。 • 为什么电池被过度放电? • 因为数据记录仪继续耗电。 • 数据记录仪耗电应在原有规格中体现，为何会存在问题？ • 数据记录仪的实际工作电流是原有规格的两倍高。这一点以前并不清楚。 • 电池低电压 只高两毫安。但是原有规格的两倍, 造成大问题和经济损失。

  29. Why BMS heating? • Soft ware and heat sink cannot handle heat generated by BMS. • Why so much heat is produced inside BMS? • Because the current is higher than expected. • Why BMS is designed like this? • The current information is wrong. • No enough good self-protect function in BMS. • BMS heating Original information is wrong, and without additional testing, problem was not foreseen.

  30. 为什么BMS 会发热? • 软件和散热器无法应付 BMS产生的热量。 • 为何BMS内部会产生如此多的热量? • 因为电流强度比预期要高。 • 为什么如此设计BMS? • 电流相关信息错误。 • BMS自我保护功能欠缺。 • BMS 发热 原有信息错误，没有进一步的测试，未能预见问题。

  31. Why BMS shut-down? • Because of the self-protection function of the BMS. • Why self-protection inside BMS? • Because unlike other batteries, good performance of lithium ion battery can only be obtained during specific conditions of charge / discharge. • BMS shutdown BMS Design wrong for this customer. Entire system (motor, controller, battery) needed evaluation and testing.

  32. 为什么BMS停止工作？ • 因为BMS的自我保护功能。 • 为什么BMS内部有自我保护功能? • 因为不同于其它电池，锂离子电池只有在特定的充放电条件下才能有良好表现。 • BMS停止工作 为客户设计的BMS 错误。整个系统 (电机, 控制器, 电池) 需要评估和测试。

  33. Solutions found, but costs are high for all partners! Many Lessons Learned. Costs of Lessons Very Large! • 0 voltage battery solved. • BMS heating solved. • BMS shutdown no more.

  34. 找到了解决方案，但三方都付出了高代价！ 吸取了很多教训!教训的代价非常高！ • 电池零电压问题解决。 • BMS发热问题解决。 • BMS停止工作问题解决。

  35. Developing Communications, Testing, Learning to Trust Each Other, Working Together… • 0 voltage battery solved. • BMS heating solved. • BMS shutdown no more.

  36. 加强沟通, 测试,学会相互信任, 共同努力… • 电池零电压问题解决。 • BMS发热问题解决。 • BMS停止工作问题解决。

  37. How Problems Were Solved • Leadership was key. Bosses of all three companies good communicators, determined to solve problems. • Created more communication – multi channel, multi level. Boss to boss, technology person to technical person, sales people to sales people. • Question every detail. Listen to every answer carefully. • Improve testing and rely more on test data than opinion. • Bosses focused on keeping team going, keeping everyone thinking about results – not who is to blame. • Face to face meetings in Suzhou, Longkou, Los Angeles helped a lot. • Everyone learning to admit mistakes and discuss honestly and focus on how to fix. • Wettsen and Phylion willingness to spend money and effort to fix. • Group learned that many original ideas about specification and use patter were wrong. • Change batteries and BMS several times. Still failing in field. • Finally…change battery cells to higher power that suits high power motor. Add capacitor.

  38. 问题是如何解决的 • 领导是关键。三方领导沟通能力强；有解决问题的决心。 • 更多的沟通和交流。多渠道，多层面。领导之间, 技术人员之间，销售人员之间。 • 询问每一个细节，仔细倾听每一个答案。 • 改进测试，更多的依靠测试数据，而非意见。 • 三方领导专注于保持团队前进，使每个人思考结果-而不是思考到底是谁的问题。 • 在苏州，龙口，洛杉矶面对面的交流帮助很大。 • 每个人都学着承认错误，诚恳的交流，专注于如何解决问题。 • 玮辰和星恒愿意投入金钱和精力来解决问题。 • 三方意识到原来许多对规格和使用模式的认识是错误的。 • 数次更换BMS和电池。在实际使用过程中仍出现问题。 • 最终…提高电池功率适应大功率电机。安装电容器。

  39. Costs of Problems Were Huge! • 2 years of unsatisfactory sales in USA market. • Sale of company complicated by battery problems. • New high power batteries working well but expensive for Wettsen and Phylion • All three companies and all staff involved much more capable than before!

  40. 为出现的问题付出了巨大的代价！ • 两年来美国市场的销售额不尽人意。 • 电池问题使公司出售复杂化。 • 新的大功率电池运行良好，但对玮辰和星恒是昂贵的。 • 三家公司及参与员工的能力比以前大有提升！

  41. Lessons Learned Together • If we can learn from our mistakes and experiences, we can benefit in the future. • AECF, Phylion and Wettsen have all learned a lot. • Here are some of the lessons learned from our experience and from other experiences at Phylion, AECF and Wettsen.

  42. 共同吸取的教训 • 如果我们现在吸取经验教训，将来定会受益。 • AECF, 星恒和玮辰都从中学到了很多。 • 下面是从这次经历以及星恒，AECF和玮辰的以往经历中总结的经验教训。

  43. 1.Build the Bike Around the Battery!2. Consider the Whole System! • Battery must be first determinant of performance and power. • Motor, Controller, Battery must be considered as one system! • Not parts that can be bolted together.

  44. 1.以电池为中心制造整车！2.通盘考虑整个系统!1.以电池为中心制造整车！2.通盘考虑整个系统! • 电池是决定性能和功率的第一要素。 • 电机，控制器和电池必须作为整体通盘考虑! • 而非固定在一起的部件。

  45. Example of Whole System Analysis

  46. 整体系统分析

  47. Possible reason to trigger BMS over discharge protection function

  48. 可能启动BMS过度放电保护功能的原因

  49. Suggestions for corrective actions

  50. 改进建议

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